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#2034 - 06/05/08 07:13 PM Exp Display Messaging
Candanuca Offline
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Registered: 04/18/08
Posts: 3
In regards to the recent change about exp messaging taken away I would like to say a few things.

First I believe it is very newbie friendly and that seems to be the focus of a lot of changes lately such as HMs not being HMs on the who list. The messages give people a great sense of what they are getting for which spells and especially how effective their weapons are in combat. It can be hard to gauge this otherwise.

I also understand that it can be very annoying especially in combat or for doing long terms for the same exp we have memorized anyway.

This is why I would suggest that it become part of setenv and have the default be on so that new players can know how they are gaining exp, and old players can turn it off when they become annoyed with it. As a variable setting it can also be turned on and off allowing people to check for a period of time how much exp they are getting.

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#2035 - 06/05/08 07:24 PM Re: Exp Display Messaging [Re: Candanuca]
Muod Offline
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Registered: 10/04/07
Posts: 148
Loc: MA/CA
Personally I feel that adding more and more numbers to the game remove the illusion that the game is trying to create. As for the numbers part, you can easily put your exp in your status to see how much you get for a spell with a little math.

Also by seeing the numbers, you get people like me who figure out formulas which definitely ruins a bit of the illusion when you can figure out what spell at what level/power will give what exp then compare it to what the cost of the spell is to optimize training to make sure you get the most exp per dev. (yes I have done this)

As for it being more or less newbie friendly I don't know. I can definately understand why a newbie would like to see the numbers for a better understanding of what works and what doesnt but at the same time what works and what doesn't should be more evident from effect then anything else. If i hit something hard I should get more exp because I'm hitting hard, not because I see the numbers.

Also with exp in prompt it's very easy to write a zmud script to have it pull how much exp you get for anything. I could of written one in the time I took to make this post.

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#2036 - 06/05/08 07:30 PM Re: Exp Display Messaging [Re: Muod]
Minstrel Offline
journeyman
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Registered: 12/14/07
Posts: 89
I'm largely agnostic, but it's completely untrue that you can't figure out combat effectiveness of different weapons without xp messages. You have access to your raw xp. If you can't use that to figure out how well your weapons are working to generate xp...that doesn't say positive things about you.

I agree with Muod that more numbers ruin the illusion. So, while it's not a big deal to me, I'd probably vote against the messages. I'd also vote against the levels of mobs being displayed. That's very ugly-ifying to the atmosphere. Descriptions (long and short) should be trying to paint a word picture, and "behind-the-scenes numbers" spoil that.


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#2037 - 06/05/08 07:36 PM Re: Exp Display Messaging [Re: Minstrel]
Muod Offline
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Registered: 10/04/07
Posts: 148
Loc: MA/CA
People knew what weapons were good for what well before seeing exp but I think candanuca's point of it being helpful to newbies specifically new players is true. Honestly it comes to taste in how we enjoy games, some like the extra numbers and knowing what does what specifically and others like it to be more mysterious.
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#2038 - 06/05/08 07:42 PM Re: Exp Display Messaging [Re: Muod]
Ganelon Offline
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Registered: 12/05/07
Posts: 75
I would like to have setenv option so one could chose the level of immersion. Since the raw xp numbers are available anyway having the engine display this data instead of programming the client is just the matter of convenience, especially for newer players.
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#2039 - 06/05/08 08:09 PM Re: Exp Display Messaging [Re: Ganelon]
Candanuca Offline
stranger


Registered: 04/18/08
Posts: 3
What I meant in saying that it was hard to gauge exp in combat was more to the effect of what a specific message on a weapon was. Like does combining ice and fire at *2 make a big difference in the exp I'm getting for those crits versus *4. Not just looking at how much my exp went up after a combat round or two. Sure you can gauge in general which weapon is better but not actually figuring out what components of the weapon are being most useful.

And as Ganelon was getting at, if we can just calculate it anyway it's going to ruin the "magic" for the same people that would want it displayed. At least newbies can see what their looking at instead of vague crit messages.

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#2041 - 06/06/08 05:12 AM Re: Exp Display Messaging [Re: Candanuca]
Siani Offline
stranger
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Registered: 11/30/07
Posts: 18
Loc: Hell
I am for removing the exp messages but with the option of being able to toggle them on/off. Being able to see the exp your gaining is helpful for new players and as we are attracting more of those it would be nice to start out with the messages on and being able to change those settings via setenv.

And as for math and equations....Screw you all I really hope you die irl. >^.^<
_________________________
Ad astra per aspera. - To the stars through rough places.

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#2043 - 06/06/08 11:16 AM Re: Exp Display Messaging [Re: Siani]
Cerberus Administrator Offline
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Registered: 11/28/07
Posts: 608
Loc: Arlee, MT, USA
Poll closes immediately before next Immortal Call-In meeting. Results won't be displayed until then. If you select "other" as your choice, please post what you mean by that.
Experience Messages
You may choose only one (11 total votes)
No experience gain messages
-
3 27%
Experience gain messages (default off)
-
4 36%
Experience gain messages (default on)
-
4 36%
Experience gain messages (other)
-
0 0%
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Please mail your views on balance to:
cerberus@darkemud.com

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#2044 - 06/06/08 11:23 AM Re: Exp Display Messaging [Re: Candanuca]
Minstrel Offline
journeyman
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Registered: 12/14/07
Posts: 89
 Originally Posted By: Candanuca
What I meant in saying that it was hard to gauge exp in combat was more to the effect of what a specific message on a weapon was. Like does combining ice and fire at *2 make a big difference in the exp I'm getting for those crits versus *4. Not just looking at how much my exp went up after a combat round or two. Sure you can gauge in general which weapon is better but not actually figuring out what components of the weapon are being most useful.


I quite disagree. I never had a problem figuring out the relative importance of various weapon-building components prior to the xp messages. And I wasn't talking about "checking a round or two." That, in fact, is what xp messages are best for...seeing the round-to-round xp.

As for whether the mass of xp messages are helpful to newbies or overwhelming, I'm undecided.

But I would lean to keeping xp messages removed for the sake of atmosphere.


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#2047 - 06/07/08 12:07 PM Re: Exp Display Messaging [Re: Minstrel]
Charon Offline
enthusiast
****

Registered: 10/24/07
Posts: 368
Loc: Toronto, ON
If somebody wants to work with the numbers there are a lot of ways to do that.

When I was leveling my monk and discovered I was having a lot of difficulty with magic, I trained completely by the numbers. I ensured that I recieved maximum xp gain for every dev spent.

Muod pretty much perfected my original sheet into including casting skill and multiple casting skills. To make the spreadsheet work the xp for spells and xp mods for the races we were playing had to be calculated but it was really anybody with high-school algebra should be able to figure it out in a few minutes.

I would be ok without even seeing how much xp to level. A percentage indicator (72% to level XX) or even just a description: "You have barely begun the journey to expand your mind" or something.
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If you say plz because it is shorter than please, then I will say no because it is shorter then yes.

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