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by MacTORG
05/22/20 10:22 AM
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#843 - 12/15/07 11:47 AM Re: Pwipe Vote: Please vote on the options below [Re: Gabe]
Kim Offline
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Registered: 10/11/07
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Loc: Europe
"Arii has a big character, but she's also put in a *huge* amount of time getting there."

So? Somebody in a less unbalanced guild putting in the same time would not get near her levels.

You argue well for what I say \:\)

"Why is the current xp rate available to the more well-off guilds a problem? I don't see a problem with having high level characters,"

You see.. this is a PK/looting mud. That's why there should be some balance. That some guilds get so far ahead so easily is a problem in that regard.

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#844 - 12/15/07 12:00 PM Re: Pwipe Vote: Please vote on the options below [Re: Kim]
Kim Offline
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Oh yes... And about thieves being fixed... that just increases the cause for a pwipe, if true. Pyrax wouldn't have gained his S-levels if thieves truly have been fixed (and a few days ago, Garin said thieves still gain 3 million/hour. That's hardly fixed...).
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#845 - 12/15/07 12:00 PM Re: Pwipe Vote: Please vote on the options below [Re: Kim]
Minstrel Offline
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Registered: 12/14/07
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I am not currently for a pwipe. However, in support of what Kim is saying, IF there was a proper re-balancing of guilds, especially with respect to xp gain, I would see no alternative to a pwipe.

Assuming the crafter guild isn't done as originally proposed (folding in and replacing enchanters and tinkers), then there really hasn't been a change to warrant deleting everyone's characters. I'm not someone who clings desperately to characters...I've deleted Silk and Octavian. With no regrets. But I don't see the point to everyone losing characters they like *without reason*. Right now, there isn't reason, IMO.

I think a re-balancing of all the guilds at one time in a coherent way (thinking about the big picture with every change) is very necessary. Currently we have a system of fixes in isolation, which has created a somewhat haphazard collection of imbalances. The imbalances mitigate each other enough that the game is playable, but make certain aspects of the game quite unfair.

So, if that sort of big-picture re-balancing effort can be done, I'd be all for a pwipe. Without that, or other massive changes that completely change how players level, I don't think a pwipe accomplishes anything except a very short-term equalness among everyone (in an environment where equalness among individuals has never been the point or ideal).

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#846 - 12/15/07 12:09 PM Re: Pwipe Vote: Please vote on the options below [Re: Kim]
Gabe Offline
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Registered: 10/14/07
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The xp differential is certainly an issue, but it's one that can be corrected, with some effort.

It's an issue that has been lingering for 7+ years, and even consciously and deliberately preserved by admin (I spoke with Madoc about it personally as an issue, and he said that's how he wanted it) and suddenly it's such a big deal that people want to use it as a lever to wipe everyone's progress?

The only 'solution' that's been posed as part of the upcoming changes is a static xp cap, and i think it's an exceptionally poor idea. Limiting people is not the way to go... equalizing potential xp gain, combined with the designing of content that can challenge high-level players, is a better direction. Granted, it would take more work, but the work would have a worthwhile reward, in that there wouldn't be a glass ceiling lingering for people who want to see how far they can really go.

As things stand, people in the middle level ranges are still subject to the same differentials (not a lot of correction has been made to equalize guilds from an xp-potential standpoint).

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#847 - 12/15/07 12:19 PM Re: Pwipe Vote: Please vote on the options below [Re: Gabe]
Kim Offline
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"equalizing potential xp gain, combined with the designing of content that can challenge high-level players, is a better direction. Granted, it would take more work, but the work would have a worthwhile reward, in that there wouldn't be a glass ceiling lingering for people who want to see how far they can really go."

We have different views here. I want higher levels to take some time, not just a week of hard playing to reach Highmortal.

Equalizing potential XP gain is fine, as long as the max possible is a LOT lower than it is.

And that would still require a pwipe. Unless you have no problem with suddenly having everybody reach level 50 in a few weeks or maybe a month. A mud of gods...

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#848 - 12/15/07 12:23 PM Re: Pwipe Vote: Please vote on the options below [Re: Kim]
Gabe Offline
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Registered: 10/14/07
Posts: 18
 Originally Posted By: Kim
"Arii has a big character, but she's also put in a *huge* amount of time getting there."

So? Somebody in a less unbalanced guild putting in the same time would not get near her levels.

You argue well for what I say \:\)

"Why is the current xp rate available to the more well-off guilds a problem? I don't see a problem with having high level characters,"

You see.. this is a PK/looting mud. That's why there should be some balance. That some guilds get so far ahead so easily is a problem in that regard.


I have been in support of balancing guild xp from the beginning. If there's an argument there, i'm not involved. The statement that you made, for which i'd like to hear reasoning, is this one: "There is too much XP for most guilds already..."

I don't necessarily think it's true or untrue, but i am curious why you think it's a problem, and what you think should be done to correct it, if you can think of a solution besides the static xp cap.

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#849 - 12/15/07 12:32 PM Re: Pwipe Vote: Please vote on the options below [Re: Gabe]
sabu Offline
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Registered: 10/22/07
Posts: 88
Loc: wisconsin
Here is a broad question about Exp. The Chaos ball spell at *6 can earn from arund 6k-36 exp per cast. You can get this spell around 6-9th level. Is this fair that a level 6-9 charecter can earn that much exp from 1 spell that is pretty cheap to get too *6 with.
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#850 - 12/15/07 12:33 PM Re: Pwipe Vote: Please vote on the options below [Re: Gabe]
Kim Offline
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Registered: 10/11/07
Posts: 204
Loc: Europe
Should the game just be about high levels? High levels, in my reasoning being 45+. As is, the levels until then are very fast, if you know what you are doing, they very much fly past, with no real sense of.... being there.

I think levels should start fast and then get slower and slower. As is, there is no real slowdown. You just keep going at much the same speed eternally. The mud is in risk of becoming top heavy, even with the high rebirth rate we have, just because attaining the higher levels again is so... easy. Since May or so, I have reached 50+ overall with.... *thinks* 4 characters... Enchanter, Paladin, Tinker and Fighter. I rebirthed two of them casually, because I knew that getting back to 50+ overall was no real challenge, just the question of a month or so at most. Even for somebody with a much lower play time than mine, it is very fast.

In short, I feel it's too quick and too easy.

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#851 - 12/15/07 12:37 PM Re: Pwipe Vote: Please vote on the options below [Re: Kim]
Kim Offline
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Registered: 10/11/07
Posts: 204
Loc: Europe
Furthermore, I see buffers as a good solution. It encourages... doing things. You don't have to fight constantly, you get some respite to talk, or kill somebody or go castle looting while draining. \:\)
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#852 - 12/15/07 12:38 PM Re: Pwipe Vote: Please vote on the options below [Re: Kim]
sabu Offline
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Registered: 10/22/07
Posts: 88
Loc: wisconsin
So what would you suggest, up the exp needed to level or possibley instead of balanceing out the guilds exp rate. Change the amount needed for each guild. Instead of 1 static amount for everyone.
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